COTW: Bricks, Steel, and Sea Life
This week’s comment of the week is a favorite for a few reasons. First, it provides us with a bit of imagery. It’s not all pretty, but it certainly paints a picture. Second, it provoked discussion. Little did we know that R.R. Anderson had so many opinions about architects. We don’t necessarily agree with him… but it definitely got a few folks thinking.
if by ‘wow factor’ you mean a building that looks like it was coughed up by a sea cucumber (read E.M.P.), then you can keep it.
I prefer buildings that are functional to human beings, and not some sadomasochist freak-job architect’s wet dream.
Why I could carve a better seattle public library out of a banana. The only difference is you’d want to clad my banana in titanium for no reason.
Oh my.
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32 comments
M Mofo from the Hood April 6, 2008
Do we live in a world of ideas or a world of things?
Maybe Mr. Anderson is saying that some ideas should just remain ideas.
There is an inital test for ideas: Does a proposed idea create misery or reduce misery?
S Squid April 7, 2008
I am miserable when I walk down a street lined with “functional” but spiritually stultifying buildings.
But that’s just me.
R RR Anderson April 7, 2008
a functional building is by definition spiritually uplifting.
Anything you perceive as stultifying can be considered a design flaw.
Yes a building can be both beautiful and useful to human beings. Thats good design.
M Mofo from the Hood April 7, 2008
Thank you Mr. Anderson. As I understand it, you’re drawn to good design.
R RR Anderson April 7, 2008
mofo, I’m pro good design but i’m not completely anti-whimsy. I think whimsy is valid in it’s right to exist.
Also if you go back to teh thread, an architect raises several valid points that I felt bad about playing devils advocate against.
it’s all good :-)
S Squid April 8, 2008
RR@3: OK, but many could and would argue that the Rainier Pacific building is “functional,” yet it is perhaps the worst example of design I have ever seen. Worse by several multiples than the Courtyard by Marriot even.
Personally, I am swayed by an 8-year old’s (mine) review of the Seattle Public Library – “this place is COOL.” Regarding EMP, her analysis was “this is the ugliest building in the world.”
I’ll go with that.
R RR Anderson April 8, 2008
Squid.. Worse by several multiples than the Courtyard by Marriot even?
hmmm. you must be one of those insane people I keep reading about.
also yeah Seattle Public Library is kinda cool in the fun-house kind of way.
Just needs the wavy mirrors and we’d be golden.
A an architect April 8, 2008
Squid … Although the Rainier Pacific Bank building is not an aesthetically pleasing building by any stretch I wouldn’t go so far as to say it is worse than the Marriot by several multiples. They are each ugly in their own special way. Even though they are functional it’s too bad more consideration wasn’t given to aesthetic value.
Design, in most cases should not trump function, but function should never be without design.
Your daughter has a keen eye. The Seattle Public Library is a great example of phenomenal design and functionality. The EMP has some great rationale behind it but ultimately fails.
D drizell April 8, 2008
I’ve been rejected from architecture school because I expressed the opinion that Frank Gehry is an idiot. Apparently, criticizing a starchitect is a capital offense.
I’ve never been in the EMP, but I have visited the library once or twice before. I’ve found it to be very disorienting. It’s very difficult to locate materials and the entrances and exits are not arranged very well. I would not want to be in that building if there were a fire or earthquake.
To their credit, though, many people would instantly recognize the buildings as being in Seattle, whether they are familiar with Seattle or not. Like the Space Needle, they are icons of the city. There are very few buildings in Tacoma that are unique enough that someone from Atlanta would instantly recognize it as being from Tacoma.
S Squid April 8, 2008
@8. OK, so I exaggerated regarding the Courtyard vs. RP. Neither has much to redeem themselves. However, if you are walking on the sidewalk next to the Courtyard, it’s actually not SO bad. Brick facade, elegant black awnings mix OK with the beautiful PG/Union Bank building adjacent. It is when you step back from the hotel that its design failure is most apparent.
RP is simply as bad a disaster near and far which is too bad. I expect a national hotel chain to give me cookie-cutter, but hopeful that a local company would care more.
Driz: comment about finding materials at SPL is point taken. However, I have trouble finding materials in ANY library. ;) Given that the building went up a scant five years ago, I am sure it meets and well exceeds seismic and fire supression standards. No worries there. Have you ever been on the “red” level? That area is amazing.
P precast April 8, 2008
Do any of you go beyond Pacific Avenue?
Head over to visit the new science building at TCC. There is excellent design happening all over town, just not in downtown.
B beerBoy April 9, 2008
Gehry had one brilliant design and, like Tacoma’s famous glass artist, has been repeating himself ever since.
But the Seattle Public Library is brilliant.
Perhaps this is the kind of architecture R.R. prefers?
www.nyc-architecture.com/ARCH/Notes-Fascist.htm
S Squid April 9, 2008
One last comment from me, while I would join those who generally dislike Gehry and EMP’s exterior, I have to say that I love the exhibits and the internal lay-out. I go at least a couple times a year and enjoy myself every time.
S Squid April 9, 2008
OK, I lied. Turning positive for a minute, one building that I think gets too often overlooked is Antoine Predock’s Tacoma Art Museum, which I think is absolutely outstanding. Some other Predock designs leave me cold (I can think of the performing arts center at UC Santa Cruz as one example), but TAM is brilliant inside and out. We are lucky to have it and I think it is one of the most under-appreciated un-sung architectual heroes in Tacoma.
S Squid April 9, 2008
Eh, my mother is too drunk to wear army boots.
R RR Anderson April 9, 2008
heck we could be brothers! :)
S Squid April 10, 2008
Hey, my dad traveled a lot…
B beerBoy April 10, 2008
Interesting how so many how so many spaces that one enters into (by definition yonnic) have had phallic structures appended to them. From a Lacanian standpoint with a feminist view it is clear that the dominant aesthetic of Eurocentric architecture serves the hegemonic patriarchal structure.
The revulsion one feels from Gehry is due to the disorientation caused by his plagiarization of primarily yonnic forms from Gaudi fabricated with the hard, metalic, rigid body armor of stainless steel favored by militaristic masculine cults.
M Mofo from the Hood April 10, 2008
beerBoy @21: “…many spaces that one enters into (by definition yonnic) have had phallic structures appended to them.”
Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar—-Sigmund Freud
B beerBoy April 10, 2008
MoFo, did you go to R.R.‘s link @ 17 with the handy-dandy roll-overs that label the anatomical references?
And, just in case anyone was taking me seriously – theoryspeak is a wonderful method of b.s.
M Mofo from the Hood April 11, 2008
Thanks beerBoy @23. Somehow I overlooked Mr. Anderson’s reference.
And in case anyone ever takes me seriously, please let me know.
*Also, Freudianism is like Radical Feminism—-an annoying method of b.s..
*Not joking on this statement.
B beerBoy April 11, 2008
Back in grad school, one of my thesis committee members, while not able to find any fault with the logic in the paragraph I wrote that demonstrated that Freud’s logic was flawed and completely errant about my topic, insisted that I tone it down with an endnote disclaimer that essentially stated “Freud is god, I am nothing, don’t pay attention to what I said”.
Critical Cultural theory provides interesting lenses to view the world with but, when one is used as your primary paradigm it prevents you from seeing anything else.
My first masters program was run by political lesbians. I, being a large, confident (if not cocky), heterosexual white man was immediately held in contempt. My first class assignment was a spoken word piece I titled “I am the Oppressor”. Have to say it didn’t earn me many fans.
M Mofo from the Hood April 11, 2008
Funny stuff, beerBoy; including your spoken word piece “I am the Oppressor.”
Freudians and political lesbians need both sympathy and reeducation.
S Squid April 11, 2008
Lipstick lesbians on the other hand need neither sympathy or reeducation. Then again, LL’s are in all likelihood an urban myth. No reliable siting has ever been documented.
R RR Anderson April 12, 2008
Beerboy, squid… mofo you guys have managed to scare away all the ladies and now this thread has turned into a creepy sausage party.
where’s the finesse?
C crenshaw sepulveda April 12, 2008
Finesse is a former stripper at the old Esmeralda’s on Pacific. Sadly she retired today and probably living in the Winthrop.
B beerBoy April 12, 2008
Finesse?
I didn’t know we were playing Bridge.
M Mofo from the Hood April 12, 2008
RR @28, I’m the big brother you never had. When it comes to women, I want you to remember one thing: Women don’t like wussies.
The man leads. The woman follows. If that order is reversed, that is, if you give up your power then you may never get it back…I pity that fool. Sometimes those kind of guys become architects and then their inner torment and confusion later becomes manifest in distorted construction projects.
C crenshaw sepulveda April 12, 2008
I’m seeing an “Ask Mofo” section of Exit133 in the near future. Think of it as a virtual woodshed.
R RR Anderson April 13, 2008
speaking of ladies. I was savagely defeated by one last Friday… I had the golden chalk championship crown yanked viciously from my skull—No Mercy style.
C crenshaw sepulveda April 13, 2008
I fear this whole competition will take on the proportions of professional wrestling. What next, a bikini grudge match? This can not end well, possibly the bikini grudge match, but I digress. Friendly competition. Good times at Frost Park, that is the goal. Bringing art to the grimy sidewalks of Tacoma is the goal. Mr. Anderson, I implore you, do not let this chalk arms race escalate. What would Larry Frost do?
R RR Anderson April 13, 2008
crenshaw,
It started with simple blackboard white chalk.Next they brought colored chalk.
Perhaps in the future they will bring glitter to lay atop their colored chalk.
Yet if things go in that direction, our artists MUST not back down.
and the spirit of Larry Frost lives on; contained in the fire of every chalk champion’s heart.