Take the Sound Transit Survey!

15 comments

• E Erik B. February 24, 2008

  I just took the survey and voted for streetcars in Tacoma the best I could.

  But the survey makes it sort of hard.

  I added “add an intercity streetcar system in Tacoma” in the blank spaces.

• H Highwater February 24, 2008

  I’ve also taken the survey. My “extra” comments were to oppose the use of sales tax as a funding mechanism and to argue against bundling stupid road projects like the Cross-Base highway with transit. After the failure last fall, let’s hope at least the mixing of road projects with transit goes away. Sound Transit is still proposing a large (0.5% or greater) increase in the sales tax as the primary funding mechanism, however. Advocate for a less regressive means of funding!

• E Elliot February 24, 2008

  My closing comments:

  “Putting out surveys that present modest goals on unreasonably long timelines (like getting to Kent in TWENTY YEARS, or even mentioning the year 2030) makes Sound Transit look really bad. The major transcontinental railroads were built in less time. I’d much rather see Sound Transit appealing to the public to put pressure on the cities and counties to grant ST more authority and funding so that these projects can be done in 2-5 years. Five years to lay 10 miles of track is far from optimistic, but with an agency as anemic as ST it seems impossible.”

  I don’t like ST very much right now. That could have to do in part with how often they’ve had small busses on the 586 route recently.

• M morgan February 24, 2008

  Ditto the comments above. I put “expand Tacoma LINK” in all the comment fields I could. With a short construction timeline is critical for the ballot measure to pass. I hope ST board members are listening this time.

• C Crenshaw Sepulveda February 24, 2008

  People, we don’t need surveys, we don’t need consultants, we need action. The traditional corridors of traffic in Tacoma are well known and have been well known for probably 100 years. Talking about this does nothing, surveying about this does nothing. Laying track does something, running street cars does something.

  The only way to do this is to do like Portland did by building the Max system over the objections of just about everyone. Sure they all love it now, but not when it was getting off the ground.

  We need visionaries, not survey takers. We can find our way to the airport, we need to have a Tacoma that works. A street car system will go a long way to making Tacoma work. Forget about a link to the airport, the bus works just fine . Spend the dough on a good rail system for inside Tacoma.

  The LINK was a good start, not a great start but I see why it was done the way it was done. Sound Transit, this is what you have to do, go to the Tacoma Public Library, wander into the Northwest Room, take a look at the old maps of the street car lines in Tacoma and Robert is your mother’s brother. Then wander up to the Fishhouse on MLK, have a nice fish and chips lunch, your work is done. Rocket science, this is not.

• E Erik B. February 24, 2008

  My “extra” comments were to oppose the use of sales tax as a funding mechanism and to argue against bundling stupid road projects like the Cross-Base highway with transit.

  Yeah, paying for roads subsidized by sales tax is the worst case senario on several points.

  Any funding for transit should be paid for by user fees as much as posssible such as a gas tax. Excise tax on cars is somewhere in between but is not really related to use as much.

  Otherwise, the funding package subsidizes car use and sprawl.

  The only possible benefit ST package could have for Tacoma is an intercity streetcar system. A tax for cross base, a new Tacoma Mall interchange is worse than nothing.

• E Erik S February 24, 2008

  A street car system will go a long way to making Tacoma work. Forget about a link to the airport, the bus works just fine . Spend the dough on a good rail system for inside Tacoma.

  Gotta agree with this, Crenshaw. I also agree that timelines stretching to 2024, 2028, and 2030 are incredibly discouraging. Yeah, yeah, “if we don’t start now it will take even longer”. Well, stuff that. I told ST that if they want my respect and support they’ll pump some dollars into expanding bus service now and come back later with a plan for rail that doesn’t span 3 decades.

  It really sucks that our major cities are barely connected by our existing transit system. I want a viable alternative to driving, at least between downtown Seattle and downtown Everett/Tacoma/Bellevue. I say get that running before you start talking about light rail in Bellevue or Issaquah. In the meantime, we can spend our resources on getting a system running in Tacoma, hopefully much faster than anything ST has proposed.

• N Nick February 25, 2008

  I forgot to save the comments I submitted, but I tried to put as much emphasis on expanding the LINK in Tacoma.

  I also pointed out how “Seattle-centric” every option in the survey was. Suggesting that if this is supposed to be a regional transit package, perhaps the benefits to the region should be more comprehensive than just “improving access to Seattle.”

• C Crenshaw Sepulveda February 25, 2008

  Chris, thanks for putting this map together for us. Roche is an old buddy of mine and a great rail resource. We really did have a great rail system here in Tacoma prior to the 40’s and it is a shame it wasn’t maintained to this day. Friends, we don’t need another survey, we don’t need more discussion, we know what needs to be done. If our local elected officials don’t pull the trigger on this we need to let them know via the ballot box. I know there are some fancy Seattle consultants that would like to help the City separate itself from its money, but we should say no thanks, I think we can figure this out ourselves.

• N Nick February 25, 2008

  Chris you’re definitely right, and I’m sure it has a lot to do with population density. I’d just like to see some forward-thinking in their plan as well (maybe consider the likelihood that Seattle will not be the only high-density area within the region over the next 20-30 years).

  If you compare the future population growth potential of Seattle to that of some of the other region’s anchor cities (like Tacoma, Bellevue, Everett, etc.), I’d be willing to bet the upside potential is much greater for these other outlying cities. Especially Tacoma, which I think has the most amount of growth ahead of it.

  Just some speculation fueled by an evening cup of coffe, so take it for what it’s worth ;-)

• N Nick February 25, 2008

  Ooh and thanks for posting up that map! It looks like we had quite an impressive system back in the day!

  I’m guessing this area’s population was quite a bit smaller than it is now, yet it was able to support the development of a very impressive streetcar system. It makes me wonder what we might be capable of creating now if so many surveys, red tape, and bureaucracy weren’t holding us back.

• M morgan February 25, 2008

  Chris- that map is fantastic! Thanks for making it and sharing it with us!

• R Reuben McKnight February 25, 2008

  Chris:

  This map is a wonderful tool. Do you have a shapefile of it you’d be willing to share?

  Thanks,
  Reuben McKnight

• N NSHDscott February 25, 2008

  Like others have commented, I found the survey made it hard to fully express my desire for expanding Link within Tacoma, not to Seattle. I remember getting to rate from 1-7 how much I wanted within-Tacoma expansion, but then when it got to the A or B part, it didn’t show up.

  In my comments at the end I communicated this desire, and suggested a new incremental-style plan. I basically said that Tacoma has a line and Seattle has a line. With each new tax measure, we should extend one or both ends of both lines a bit further.

  For example, in this tax measure, Tacoma’s line should go to Tacoma General (or further). The Seattle south end should extend down to Kent, which they seem to be targeting.

  Then in the next tax measure Seattle’s goes down to Federal Way and maybe Tacoma’s goes to Fife on one end and 6th and Union on the other, and then in the tax measure after that the two join at Fife. That makes a lot more sense to me than trying to connect them all at once at huge expense and with nothing else getting done.

  I also love the idea of cheaper streetcars branching off from the Link into Tacoma neighborhoods, and suggested that. However, I suspect that streetcars in Tacoma may not happen with Sound Transit. Julie Anderson actually replied to one of my streetcar-related emails a few days ago and basically told me that our best hope is doing a separate tax measure within Tacoma to pay for them. I’d love to see that separate measure also include funds to fix some potholes in existing roads (but not build new ones).

• D DavidS February 25, 2008

  The survey’s design is such that it really divides the sub-areas against each other. If you ask the eastsiders where they think mass transit should go in Pierce County, I expect you’ll get a pretty general: who cares? Likewise, how much thought are readers of this site putting into an express bus line on 520? If ST is going to try for an increase in taxes with the current economy it really needs to do a better job of selling the package to the people who would change their vote to a yes.

  It seems like there are a few realistic rail options for Pierce County: Increase Sounder frequency (short term), improve Sounder park & rides (short term), Sounder to Dupont (intermediate), streetcar/rail w/in Tacoma (intermediate), or light rail to SeaTac (long term). Some of these give more bang for the buck in terms of support and visibility.

  Taking off of Scott’s comment @16, do we want a regional organization trying to plan and manage Tacoma’s internal streetcar network? While the LINK has worked out well, there is a reason Pierce Transit, Metro, etc are all still independent.